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News/Business. Tamron Hall. Tamron Hall provides context and informed perspectives on the stories making headlines. New.

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Massachusetts 5, America 5, Apple 4, Wisconsin 4, Steve 4, Msnbc 4, Florida 4, Obama 4, Schwab 4, Us 4, Humana 3, California 3, North Carolina 3, New Hampshire 3, Nbc 3, Derek 3, Bill Clinton 3, Mark Murray 3, Steve Kornacki 3, George W. Bush 3,
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  MSNBC    News Nation    News/Business. Tamron Hall. Tamron Hall provides context and  
   informed perspectives on the stories making headlines. New.  

    September 28, 2012
    2:00 - 2:59pm EDT  

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>> i need you to go out and find someone that voted for barack obama and get them to vote for me, all right. >> romney's pitch comes as polling shows president obama has the advantage in nine battleground states including razor-thin leads in north carolina and nevada and a bigger lead in mitt romney's vacation destination, new hampshire. all of it comes with a new headline from politico. in the end, it's mitt. all of us making a first presidential debate, which is less than one week away now even more critical for the governor. let's bring in "news nation" panel. david godfrin, michael and steve daise, conservative radio talk show host. thanks to you for being with me on this friday. steve, let me start with you. these new poll numbers, the head-to-head showing the president now ahead in all three states, north carolina, nevada and new hampshire. new hampshire, of course,
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romney's home away from home where he has a vacation spot. governor romney's favorables continue to be underwater in all but north carolina now. combine these numbers with what we've seen all week, how worried are republicans? how worried are they that we're approaching the point where it might be time to focus on the congressional races? >> i think people are getting very worried, and i had a pollster doing conservative polling for three decades on my show last night. he said it may be time to go back to a 1996 model of telling the american people, listen, if you're going to re-elect bill clinton, you better have republicans in the congress to make sure to keep him in check. i think it may be a little early for that yet. i think the president still has weaknesses because of the economies, and i think because of that mitt romney's gin more chances than he otherwise would to make his case to the american people. i think this very first debate next week may be his last best chance to make his case.
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>> do you think if the debate's a flop for mitt romney that all of a sudden some super-pacs and big dollar donors, some of the establishment, do they begin to abandon him next thursday? >> i think it will certainly heighten and go to defcon five. what's the next color is on the homeland security chart, i lose track of them, we'll probably go to. i think what mitt needs to do, craig -- >> fuchsia. >> -- is really be himself. stop trying to be a conservative. he's not. we're not talking about a guy with deep ideological convictions. his real moral convictions are in his family where he has a picturesque american model there. beyond that, he's known for making money for himself and other people and creating jobs for those who don't have wealth. that's who he needs to be. >> it sounds like steve is saying let mitt be mitt. is it too late for that? >> well, it's not as though people don't understand who mitt
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romney is. i'm coming to you from my hometown of madison, wisconsin. wisconsin is a swing state, and wisconsin is the home state of paul ryan, who is also on the republican ticket. the gamble that the republicans made was that he would give them a bump here in the upper midwest, and that has not happened. it's not because paul ryan fails to connect with people or people don't know who mitt romney is. i think we are witnessing a full-scale swing in the pendulum. here in wisconsin scott walker survived the recall effort, but you have tammy baldwin pulling ahead of tommy thompson, a double-digit swing from where he was. she used to be trailing after the democratic convention. president obama is pulling ahead in the upper midwest. i think this may be less about -- this is only mitt romney, and mitt has to be mitt and it's all about mitt. this runs deeper than that. this is a sort of recentering of the american electorate we're witnessing. >> let's go back to the
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political article. it isn't the chair or the ho-hum convention or the looked video or stewart stevens or the improving economy or media bias or the message or mormonism. it's mitt. is it that simple? is the problem at the end of the day that it's the candidate himself? it's mitt romney who perhaps isn't what some thought he would be in terms of a candidate? >> i think it's some of the intangibles that surround the race, but i think largely it's the candidate himself. the problem, as i perceive it, is he's trying to please too many different bosses. he had to attack far to the right craig to win the primary process. he survived it. i thought there was going to be a leftward move towards the center to put him more where he was at the governor of massachusetts. it's come in drips and drags, but there's too many mitts. that's the problem. i disagree with something said.
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people know him by now. he's running for two years. they're still having a hard time putting this guy in a particular column on different issues. >> is part of it, michael, that he's not an idea log at his core, and he had to pretend to be something he is not for so long? is that part of it, you think? >> i don't know what it is, but that's what i suspect that it is. i think at his core he's a guy that really was the more centrist governor of a very liberal state. hoels did he get elected as the governor of massachusetts? >> craig, can i say something? >> go ahead. >> craig, i want to say mitt romney has two home states where he was born and raised, michigan, and where he was governor, massachusetts. he's trailing by double-digits in both. it's as if the people who know him best like him least. i don't think this is an issue of he's got to get himself out there and have people get to know him. where they know him, he's losing. >> i don't think they recognize him. i don't think those in
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massachusetts recognize the inkarn nation of mitt romney now seeking the presidency. he's not the same guy. >> his positions are different with regards to abortion, with regards to gays and gun control. i want to bring you back in here. there was an op ed written by another conservative voice who sees some issues with the romney campaign. this is from charles krauthammer. it makes you think how far ahead romney would be if he were actually running a campaign. his willingness to go big, to go for the larger argument is simply astonishing. do you think if that campaign had presented some sort of monumental, some sort of major idea at this point, do you think that perhaps he would be ahead or at least closer than he is right now? >> yes, i agree with that analysis. i've said on it this network for the last eight or nine months,
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barring that we look at a replay of 2004 with obama with a trend line similar it to george w. bush. the american people like him, but they're open to somebody better. mitt romney is now the next massachusetts guy who maybe was a flip-flopper in the past like john kerry. can he close the sale with the american people? this is a referendum on mitt romney all aalong. we already had a referendum on obama. it was the 2010 midterm elections. this is not about what happened in the next four years, but it's about who will do a better job for the next four years. romney needs to present something other than, jie, hasn't obama sucked? you cannot win like that. howard dean would be the democratic nominee and president of the united states if that was the case. you have to give people a reason to vote for you. >> steve, you make pay compelling argument there. the debates, perhaps, michael, the next opportunity and the last opportunity for mitt romney to make this case. both sides have elised memos.
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this is beth myers of the romney campaign. this is what she says in part. it's clear that president obama will use his ample rhett for cal gifts in debating experience at one end. we expect a 90-minute attack ad. david axelrod not to be outdone by the obama campaign. saying we expect mitt romney to be prepared, disciplined and aaggressive. the first debate generally favor challengers. both sides are trying to manage expectations here? >> absolutely. >> this guy's really good. >> how do we get in the ring with him all of a sudden? >> right. >> they're skilled on their feet. that's how they got this far. i don't know that the second and third debate will matter that much for governor romney if there isn't something significant out of debate number one. >> i agree. >> it's not because of the president is running ahead now. people are voting now. what those polls tell us is this the way it's going down as we speak. >> david, what do you think?
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do you think that the debate next wednesday could be some sort of game changer, or do you think we're perhaps reading way too much into it and this thing is probably already set in stone? >> nothing is ever set in stone. i agree with my colleague who said voting has already started. 40% of voters probably will vote early in this election. that makes this a different ball game. i don't think this is a make-or-break moment. i think mitt romney perceives it as a make-or-break moment. that is dangerous for him. you see, one of the biggest mistakes mitt romney could make is to come out swinging and say something rash that makes him look ridiculous like it did after the libya crisis. he has to be careful to make sure he still looks presidential and doesn't look like some sort of barracuda nipping at obama's heels. there's a delicate balance here, and if mitt romney and his advisers are treating this as the make-or-break moment, that could invite mistakes in my opinion. >> steve, what does camp romney
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need to be doing in terms of the debate next wednesday? >> well, this idea fact-checking obama is a bad idea. i think continues to make a case that the majority of the american people have demonstrated two years ago they agree with, you've conquered that hill. romney needs to look like a credible, transparent, sincere leader with a plan, and a plan that is specific and simple to understand and how benchmarks like you give investors at bain capital. he wouldn't walk into a room and say, hey, give me your money to buy this company. we'll make it all work here in the black in the next two years. offer specifics and offer benchmarks that can hold you accountable by the american people and do it credibly and sincerely. it's like obama is not on the stage. romney needs to make this case himself to the american people. >> steve, we have to leave it there. thank you my friend. democratic strategiest, david goodfrin always a pleasure. have a great weekend and safe
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travels back to philly. senator mccaskill is firing back. >> i'm a at loss. i don't know exactly what his accusation that i'm not ladylike means. >> i'm going to talk to "the cycl cycle"'s steve kornacki about that. why he says the opposite of what we were talking about essentially. don't blame romney for his campaign struggles. why tim cook is issues a very rare apology to all of you iphone users, myself included. you can join the conversation on twitt twitter @newsnation, one word. mom always got good nutrition to taste great. she was a picky eater. well, now i'm her dietitian, and last year, she wasn't eating so well. so i recommended boost complete nutritional drink to help her get the nutrition she was missing.
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back to politics. two competing reports out today on why governor romney is having such a tough election fight. the political article we just talked about argues that romney himself is to blame for his campaign trouble and not the actual campaign apparatus. the headline from salon.com gives the total opposite view, essentially. saying, quote, sorry, it's not romn romney's fault. who is to blame for his sagging performance? steve kornacki wrote that aforementioned salon.com article. he's co-host of "the cycle" that comes on at 3:00 on msnbc. tell me, where should republicans be pointing the finger if governor romney coming up short first fuse in november? >> i would say at themselves. there are obvious deficiencies with mitt romney as a candidate. i wouldn't deny that. >> the party itself is to blame? >> with the party -- romney is
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the representative of what this party has decided it wants to be. what the republican party basically decided in the obama era fingerprints to be is an anti-obama party. they've existed on, you know, the economy is bad. you're the average voter. you don't like where it is. just blame obama and use as the protest vehicle. to the extent they've decided to stand for anything, they move forward and farther to the right than they were under george w. bush and the republican congress in the 1990s. it left romney with this choice to run on their ideology, which is toxic to general election voters, or he can just run as -- if you don't like obama, just vote for me. i'm not going to fill in the blanks for you. that's what he chose. >> you claim the gop has not come to grips with the bush years. >> that's it. when obama came on to office, republicans made two decisions. one was they would fight obama on everything unilaterally. they treat him as this extremist, aradical, far left
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president and they do that. the other thing was they had to explain how a guy like that could get elected president. what they decided is obama became president because george w. bush in their view wasn't conservative enough. >> he was not ideologically pure enough? >> he sold out the conserve it active cause and dpagave it a b name and gave rise it to obama. >> you called it the single most effective line of the convention. i want to play it for our audience and talk about it. here it is. >> no president, no president, not me, not any of my predecessors, no one could have fully repaired all the damage that he found in just four years. >> what makes that such an effective line? >> that's just it. if you're romney and you've basically decided you can't run on the ideological program that the republicans in the house have been pushing for the last
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couple of years, then you're left with, swing voter, you don't like where the country is economically. use me at your protest vehicle. unemployment has been over 8% now for more than three years. there's a chance of that working, but the problem is context. what clinton expressed there is the context that sort of -- that obama is relying on voters understanding. yes, unemployment is persistly high and it's over 8% for three years. there's a reason for that. it has to do with the catastrophe that took place under obama's predecessor's watch. if you understand where we are now in the context of that, you're less likely as a voter to blindly blame obama. if our romney and rely on the blind of obama, you're in trouble. it has never been good enough to get him into the lead. >> bill clinton is saying i may be the best plummer you've ever seen, but the pipes in this house were so bad, not even i or anyone else i know could fix the pipes, huh? >> yeah. that's a compelling message. >> steve kornacki, thank you so
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much. we'll give you a few minutes to regroup and come back at 3:00. 25% of the cycle, 3:00 eastern right here on msnbc. in the past hour we learned that both president obama and romney spoke by phone today with israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu. the white house says the call was part of their regular consultations in that the two leaders underscored that they are in full agreement on the shared goal of preventing iran from obtaining a nuclear weapon. the white house says that the two leaders took note of the close cooperation and coordination between the united states and israel regarding the threat posed by iran and its nuclear program. mitt romney spoke with prime minister netanyahu less than an hour ago between campaign stops in pennsylvania. the calls follow prime minister netanyahu's u.n. speech yesterday, of course, where he dramatically drew that red line for stopping iran's nuclear program. up next right here, the rnc cutting ties with a consulting
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firm that's under investigation for voter fraud. nbc's national investigative correspondent michael isakoff has details on that. first, billionaire announcing a major donation to the pro-obama super-pac. it's one of the things we thought you should know. first, after a week of complaints from frustrated iphone users, apple's ceo tim cook now apologizing over the new maps app. he said the new maps application fell short of his commitment to make the best products for customers. last week apple's new operating system replaced google maps with apple's own application. users explained that the new software mislabeled cities, moved some landmarks, didn't provide transit directions. cook said that apple is working nonstop to improve that app. ask me what it's like when my tempur-pedic moves.
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the no. gop is the latest to fire a firm under investigation for voter fraud in florida. the company known as strategic allied consulting has been repping republican efforts to get out the vote. the republican national committee paid the company nearly $3 million this year. a revelation that has the gop throwing punches. >> it's totally different. we at this point have an allegation. that mere allegation has caused us to act swiftly and boldly and sever our ties with this firm because we have a zero tolerance when it comes to this. the on other side clearly engaged in a long time for inappropriate behavior. we don't believe it's appropriate and we wanted to make a swift and bold action to illustrate that. >> let me go ahead and bring in
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nbc's national investigative correspondent michael isakoff. is this the first time this particular consultant has been accused of voter fraud? >> nathan sproul is a former executive director of the arizona republican party. he's been aaccused of election misconduct by democrats in the past, voter suppression, throwing out voter registration forms. none of them have led to criminal charges or any civil findings against him, but it has made him a somewhat controversial figure. so one of the things mr. sproul said and when the republican national committee hired him to do this, they wanted him to set a new firm up under a name that wasn't traceable to him so it would not be a problem or create problems and create new controversy over him. well, that turned out not to be the case, obviously.
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strategic allied consulting does link back to nathan sproul and employees of his firm linked to allegations of registration fraud in florida. >> some of the information on the florida voter registration forms were trying to register people with addresses in new york, in one instance a couple was being reregistered to an address in miami that is a shell gas station. >> right. what we have is we also have reports of reports of now in eight counties in florida under investigation. employees of this firm suspected of submitting suspicious, potentially fraudulent registration forms. i talked to nathan sproul last night. he's adamant in denying any wrongdoing by him. he said if anything he was the victim here by employees of his firm who he hired to go out and collect these forms. i think people will ask
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questions about what kind of oversight there was of the employees, and frankly, the similarities to the a.c.o.r.n. charges, which was pushed by republicans against a democratic-leaning firm. >> michael, always digging deep for us. thank you, sir. do appreciate your time. have a great weekend. >> thank you. still ahead, more on the debate expectations game. a look at the strategies for both campaigns in denver. i'm going to talk to the daily beast, michael thomson. new information on the victims in the deadly workplace shooting in minnesota. it tops our stories around the "news nation." check out our "news nation" tumbler page. you will find behind the scenes pictures at newsnation.tumbler did the come. [ male announcer ] for the saver, and a big first step. for the spender who needs a little help saving. for adding "& sons."
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postscript. this week mitt romney fought from under the 47% and also the impression this thing is slipping away from him. romney is trying to down-play the recent polls while at the same time trying to put out a message of compassion on the campaign trail. >> i've got a very effective campaign. it's doing a very good job, but not everything i say is elegant. we just keep on battling forward with our message. i don't pay a lot of attention to the day-to-day polls. they change a great deal. i'm very pleased with some polls, less so with other polls but frankly at this early stage polls go up, polls go down. i care very deeply about the american people and people of different socioeconomic circumstances. don't forget, i got everybody in my state insured. 100% of the kids in our state have health insurance. the president cares about the people in america and i care about all the people in america, but i know how to help the people of america.
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look, we're going to win. there's no question in my mind. we're going to win. >> no question in his mind. joining me now, nbc's senior political editor mark murray. mark, as we saw earlier, the polls don't show a pretty picture for mitt romney right now. can he somehow turn the underdog narrative into an advantage? >> absolutely. i mean, there are always political ups and downs in campaigns. the thing mitt romney has to worry about is time is running out. 30 states across the country are engaged in early voting either by absentee or in-person early voting. time is of the essence, and this is why the debate is so important for mitt romney. outside of some external event we can't even think of right now, the debate is his last chance to really change the die nam in this cases of this contest. >> i want to talk about the missouri race for a second here and the relationship to the race. the latest remarks from missouri congressman todd akin sparking a
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bit of an uproar. he said, quote, i think we have a very clear path to victory and apparently claire mccaskill thinks we do to. she was aggressive in the debate which was quite difference. she had a confidence and was much more ladylike. in the debate on friday she came swinging because she feels threatened. on "morning joe" today senator mccaskill is responding to the comments with a warning for the gop. take a look. >> watch the national republicans. they've all said it was unacceptable what he did, and i think scott brown and linda mcmahon and a lot of candidates out there will be in trouble if the national republicans go back on their word and come in here and try to fund todd akin. >> is she right, mark murray? do you think todd akin could hurt mitt romney's chances even more? >> i don't know if it's necessarily mitt romney's chances, but republicans have a dilemma right now. todd akin doesn't have a whole
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lot of money. if they want to win back the senate they want to help him a little bit. claire mccaskill has a ceiling of 52, 53 percentage points. aakin is the underdog after his legitimate rape comments, but do republicans try to slip some money in to that missouri race, to linda mcmahon in connecticut? all indications are and we heard it from the head of the republican senatorial committee they don't see them helping out todd akin in missouri. that is something we'll watch over the next five weeks, because this is all about republicans being able to win winnable contests. >> mark murray, always a pleasure, sir. thank you. >> thanks, craig. the first presidential debate is less than a week away. predictably both the obama and romney camps are trying to keep expectations low for their own candidates while at the same time they're building up the opponent as the most for mid aable debater since abe lincoln. >> the president is obviously a
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very eloquent, gifted speaker. he'll do just fine. >> mitt romney has an advantage because he's been through 20 debates in the primaries over the last year. >> barack obama is a very effective debater. >> we know that governor romney has been practicing for months. i think the invasion of normandy took less preparation than he pult into the debates. >> he hasn't had a dedate against a democrat in over ten years, i guess probably 2002. >> i've never been in a presidential debate like this, and it will be a new experience. >> what can we really expect dpr next week's showdown in colorado? joining me is michael, special correspondent for "newsweek" and "the daily beast." everyone says this debate is an absolute must-win for mitt romney. isn't that kind of what we always say? isn't it always a do or die situation for one of the candidates? what's different this time around? >> the only thing that's different this time around,
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craig, is this is happening at an exact moment when it feels like mitt romney may be falling off the clip. he's got one leg dangling out over there. if he doesn't do something to collect himself and get back up on terra firma and head in the other direction he has a real problem. it's the timing of it, i would say, that does make it debate a little different from other previous ones. >> the recent "the daily beast" article points out some democrats are concerned that president obama may be a bit rusty and maybe a tad underprepared as well. what do you think that the president will be working on specifically this weekend with regard to debate prep? >> i'm not sure what he's working on. there are dangers here for obama, too. we don't talk as much about those. it's good that you bring it up, because it is good to talk about those. romney is a pretty good debater. whoever in the clip said there that romney has had 20 or whatever it is recent debates,
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that's true. during the primaries when romney needed to deliver a big knockout punch to newt gingrich and to rick perry, he managed to do it, and he did it very aggressively. so he knows what he's doing up there. obama needs to be on his toes. you know, i just think he can anticipate most of what romney is going to say, but he needs to have a few zingers of his own to make sure he gets his share of sound bites in the newscasts that follow. >> based on previous debate performances, how would you characterize governor romney's style versus the president's style? >> romney is good on the attack, i think. as i just indicated, i mean, when he needed to flash the knife against rick perry in that one debate i'm particularly thinking of, he really did it. he's good at that, and he's not going to back down. you know, a lot of this also
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comes down to interpersonal dynamics and how they play off each other and what their body chemistry says and so on and so forth. romney was pretty aggressive in a lot of republican debates, interrupting people, leaning forward, that sort of thing. don't think you can do that with the president of the united states. >> there was also, of course, that famous bet in south carolina. >> yeah, right. >> michael, always a pleasure. thank you, sir. >> my pleasure. wednesday's debate topic, domestic policy. naturally it will include the economy. now the latest polls somehow president obama erasing mitt romney's edge on that number one issue and actually leading in some polls who would better handle the economy. president obama is also using a new line. >> during campaign season you always hear a lot about patriotism. well, you know what? it's time for a new economic patriotism. an economic patriotism rooted in
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the belief that growing our economy begins with a strong and thriving middle class. >> joining any now "newsweek" columnist and cnbc contributor, zachary carabaugh. good friday, sir. economic patriotism is a new part of the lexicon here. >> it is a new part of the lexicon. it can mean just about anything. i don't mean to sound cynical about this. if you're for the president's economic policies, you're an economic patriot, and if you're against it, you're not. it's not a clear policy. it is a very catchy phrase. >> it is a very catchy phrase. in addition to being a centerpiece of a new ad, former ohio governor ted strickland used the phrase to take aim at romney in his democratic convention speech. take a look. >> mitt has so little economic patriotism that even his money
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needs a passport. it's summers on the beaches of the cayman islands and winters on the slopes of the swiss alps. >> it's clearly been poll-tested, the phrase itself. is this economic patriotism code for the president selling tax hikes and selling more spending on infrastructure? >> no. i think it really is a way of distinguishing himself from romney, being more positive about it. my take is president clinton had a great advice, and i think it was for john kerry in 2004, which is, always run as if the economy is doing well. his point about that was if you run on the message as romney has that the economy is in the tank and the president has messed it up, you better hope that the economic data is sufficiently bad leading up to the election that that argument that has real trenches. the problem is not that the economic data is so great, it's not. it's clearly not getting particularly worse, and there's a lot of evidence it's getting a
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little better in terms of jobs and income. that totally removes the steam from the argument of, you've messed everything up. >> sure. in addition to the actual data, there's some polling that indicates that people at least feel like the economy is improving, and the right track/wrong track question. a lot of folks more than six months ago saying we think the country is moving in a good directions. how does that happen? if the numbers aren't dramatically different how can people feel like things are okay. >> you have two phenomenon that are better, house prices and stock market prices. stock market matters if you have a retirement account. a lot of americans don't, if you do it's done better. housing prices have a whole lattice of connection to job mobility and everything else. the final point about this and where economic patriotism is a good phrase is it makes you feel you're voting for the good of the country. the problem of i'm going to vote
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because this president's policies have failed and the economy is tanking is you're voting on fear pessimism. that is not a strong argument going forward. housing market picking up and job market stabilizing and income stabilizing and the stock market doing well. this is not off to the races, but nor is it oh, my god -- >> the bottom is falling out? >> exactly. >> have a great weekend. >> thank you. coming up, why a federal judge put the filmmaker behind that anti-islam film behind bars. it's in our stories around the "news nation." first, there's a lot going on this friday, and here are a few things we thought you should know. former president bill clinton is getting back on the campaign trail for president obama. mr. clinton will be in new hampshire next wednesday, the same day they face off in their first debate. back in 1992 clinton was the first democrat to carry new hampshire since 1964.
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billionaire george soros is donating more than a billion dollars to the super-pac after initially being against super-pacs. soros will donate $500,000 to two other super-pacs supporting democrats. "snl" is at it again. cast member jay farrell channeling obama in last night's primetime election special. >> but things are getting better. remember that movie "the sixth sense"? i'm like the kid in that movie. i see employed people. i know you don't see them, don't even know they're there. one day all of you will be bruce willis, and you'll realize that you were employed all along. time for the your business entrepreneur of the week. andrew is the fourth generation owner of rosenwach tanks.
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you'll find their handmade wooden water tanks on hundreds of new york city rooftops. today they're shaped by hand with half-century old tools. he says you don't throw out what works. you just build upon it. for more watch "your business" this sunday morning at 7:30 on msnbc. ♪ ♪ ♪ hi dad. many years from now, when the subaru is theirs... hey. you missed a spot. ...i'll look back on this day and laugh. love.
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mass shooting at a minnesota business. police say the gunman killed four people inside a minneapolis sign-making business before turning the gun on himself. the owner of the business and the ups worker who was making a delivery at the time are among the victims. four other people were wounded. the name of the gunman or a possible motive have not been released. the california man who produced that anti-islamic video that sparked deadly protests around the world is now in jail. a federal judge ruled nakoula basseley nakoula is a flight risk and needs to be detained. he was arrested last nights on charges he violated his probation from a prior conviction. the owner of the site of the deadly rhode island fire site has donated the land so a permanent memorial can be built. 100 dies in that fire in 2003. the announcement brings an end to a year's long effort to secure the site by a foundation
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formed by families of those killed. they hope to break ground before the 10th anniversary of the fire on february 20th. next, disturbing allegations about a kid's football team in california. some parents and players say kids as young as 10 were paid to make big hits on opposing players details up next. you can join the "news nation" on facebook, facebook.com/newsnation. with the spark cash card from capital one, sven's home security gets the most rewards of any small business credit card! how does this thing work? oh, i like it! [ garth ] sven's small business earns 2% cash back on every purchase, every day! woo-hoo!!! so that's ten security gators, right? put them on my spark card! why settle for less? testing hot tar... great businesses deserve the most rewards! [ male announcer ] the spark business card from capital one. choose unlimited rewards with 2% cash back or double miles on every purchase, every day!
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time for the "news nation" gut check. there are disturbing allegations that young football players 10 and 11 years old were given rewards for big hits on opposing players. it's similar to the scandal involving the new orleans saints. we have the allegations now swirling around the team in
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orange county, california. >> reporter: the red cobras, one of the nation's premier pop warner football teams is accused of paying for big hits. >> if we hit someone like really hard, the best hit in the game we get paid, paid some money. >> two former players whose identities we've concealed say last year their team played under an incentive system. 10 and 11-year-olds given cash, between $20 and $50 to knock opposing players out of the game. punishing blows that are often part of the sport. >> we were targeting their best players mostly. anybody could get hit, but like the focus was on their best players. >> you were trying to take them out of the game? >> yes. >> the allegations were reported by the oc register. a former coach and parent said he blew the whistle when the season was over.
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>> it was cash for the biggest hit, and over time they introduced other concepts like, you know, bonuses for targeted players, extra money if you knock the kid out of the game, even if you hurt a kid you could get extra money. >> he's not without his own problems with the league. he was banned from pop warner for life. the league says that decision was made because of his misconduct, but zanelli and several other parents sand behind the allegations that an incentives system was in place, and he said cash was paid for hits like this one. >> big hit. >> a helmet-to-helmet collision that left one 11-year-old sidelined with a concussion. reggie scales now fears his season may have been the target of a bounty. >> clearly, it was head-to-head contact. i was very angered and it was concerning. there needs to be some builtability if these allegations are true. >> the men accused of offering
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cash for hits deny any such program ever existed. the assistant coach says the claims are nothing moerch parents seeking revenge over a long-standing dispute. have you paid your players for making great plays? >> absolutely not. >> have you paid them for making big hits? >> no way. >> have you coached them or told them to go after specific players and knock them out of the game? >> we would never intentionally hurt a football player on the opposing team. >> bowman and head coach darren crawford were initially cleared of any wrongdoing after the pop warner league says it conducted a thorough investigation. both coaches have been cited for other infractions. >> mr. crawford denies taking place in this bounty program as described by the accuser. at the same token, mr. crawford has stated that there may have been some errors in judgment unrelated to a bounty program. >> today the pop warner national
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office says it will re-open the case and re-enter view the players and coaches to step forward. they're asking them to accept aside pending outcome of the allegation. >> we have no tolerance for anything like this. we want to make sure the right thing is done to protect those players. >> last year the red cobras came just short of a national championship, a team today with players and parents now standing on opposite sides of the field. high stakes and serious allegations in a game played by kids for fun. >> touchdown. >> nbc's miguel am fweer ra there. thanks so much. what does your gut tell you? do you think the pop warner national office should re-open the investigation? go to facebook.com/newsnation to vote. look what the "news nation" is saying about yesterday's gut check, about american airlines accusing the pilots about a job
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action that causes hundreds of flight delays and cancellations. if it's true, are they helping or hurting their cause? 20% said they're helping their cause, 80% said they are hurting their cause. that does it for this edition of "news nation." i'm craig melvin. catch "news nation" with tamron hall every weekday at 2:00 eastern right here on msnbc. i'll see you back here tomorrow afternoon at 2:00. "the cycle," though, is up next. ! [ man ] out! your kind is not welcome here! nor your odd predilections! miracle whip is tangy and sweet, not odd. [ man ] it's evil! if you'd try it, you'd know. she speaketh the truth! [ crowd gasps ] [ woman ] reverend? ♪ can i have some? ♪ high up in the atlas mountains of morocco.
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